UMR installation for unlisted keyboards

[John]

If installation notes are not provided for your specific keyboard model, read this article for information about identifying the connection points & configuring the UMR:

http://highlyliquid.com/support/library/scanned-matrix-keyboards/

The UMR is not guaranteed to work with every keyboard model, but if you can identify the keyboard matrix scheme as described in the article, the odds are pretty good.

[painfulleg]

If possible, can you give some of us more noob-types a few guidelines or an example as to how to test a keyboard.

From the linked document, my understanding is that I should find the contact that triggers a note response, use a multimeter to determine if there's 5v pulse on the keyboard when a key is pressed, if so that tells you it's high-scan. Is this correct?

Sorry to bug you, I have a great keyboard that I'd love to midi-retrofit (the Yamaha PSS-380 with the full FM-mod sliders).

wb

[John]

If possible, can you give some of us more noob-types a few guidelines or an example as to how to test a keyboard.

From the linked document, my understanding is that I should find the contact that triggers a note response, use a multimeter to determine if there's 5v pulse on the keyboard when a key is pressed, if so that tells you it's high-scan. Is this correct?

It can be tough to do it with just a multimeter. The select pulse repeats many times per second, so you can't really observe the pulses without using an oscilloscope.

If you don't have a scope, the best way to begin is to visually examine the keyswitch pcb. You'll find that adjacent groups of keys are tied together--the trace that groups them together is the select line.

For example, on a 49-key keyboard, you'll often see groups of 6 keys--8 select lines each with 6 keys, and one last select line with the remaining 49th key.

You can then visually (or with help from the multimeter) follow the select traces back to the ribbon cable, and write down the pin numbers.

If the select lines make groups of 6 keys, then there should be 6 pins remaining on the ribbon cable, which are the data lines.

Once you've identified the select & data lines, you need to determine whether the matrix is "scan high" or "scan low" as described in the library article at the top of this thread. To do this, you have to look at the diodes on the keyswitch pcb, and see which way they are oriented with regard to the select & data lines. The diagrams in the article illustrate this.

Hope this helps. If you have a scope, it will be much easier to identify everything.

[painfulleg]

I kinda need to get an oscilloscope anyway. Thanks.

[Jack_of_Trades_Music]

Has anyone had any success with a Casio SA-10?

Thanks

[John]

Has anyone had any success with a Casio SA-10?

Thanks

Haven't tried it, but I would be very confident, based on the size & vintage of the keyboard. ("basic" keyboards from that time period tend to work very well with the UMR.)

[BentApparatus]

If possible, can you give some of us more noob-types a few guidelines or an example as to how to test a keyboard.

From the linked document, my understanding is that I should find the contact that triggers a note response, use a multimeter to determine if there's 5v pulse on the keyboard when a key is pressed, if so that tells you it's high-scan. Is this correct?

Sorry to bug you, I have a great keyboard that I'd love to midi-retrofit (the Yamaha PSS-380 with the full FM-mod sliders).

wb

I think there is a good chance this keyboard may be "incompatible" with the UMR kit. from what i hear all of the "FADER/SLIDER" equipped yamaha PSS keyboards lack MIDI (even the late 90's) and one of the listed incompatible "PSS 470" is pretty much the same as all the others "FADER/SLIDER" ones PSS 380/390/560/570 etc... on the other hand the same related models (PSS 480/580/680/780/790) with fully digitally incorporated parameter controls all have MIDI from the manufacturer.
basically all these keyboards are the same with different model numbers and slight changes mainly in effects and sequencer attributes.
here is a quote from some german keyboard guy who has analyzed the hardware of many of these yamaha keyboards "Possibly also the complex LFO and envelope effects would have disturbed the delicate timing of MIDI transmission because they are likely generated by the main CPU and not controlled by the sound chip itself. There is also no FM PortaSound with MIDI and synth sliders."

an interesting one is the PSS 280 which is a "preset" version of the PSS 380/390 same 100 voices(stackable by 2=500+ combinations) BUT no editable synth and only 20 beats, also its basically a more powerful
PSS 140(UMR compatible) maybe you should try to locate one John and see if its UMR gold! lol

now i could be completely wrong since i know little about MIDI and how and if the UMR's operate on the same principals/hardware as GM

*EDIT* now that i have taken a good look at how the UMR operates i think i may have just typed up a bunch of crap since it may well be possible to retrofit many of the keyboards i listed...
thats one of my super powers...making a fool of my self...lol

[John]

I think there is a good chance this keyboard may be "incompatible" with the UMR kit. from what i hear all of the "FADER/SLIDER" equipped yamaha PSS keyboards lack MIDI (even the late 90's) and one of the listed incompatible "PSS 470" is pretty much the same as all the others "FADER/SLIDER" ones PSS 380/390/560/570 etc...

This part may be true. When the UMR is incompatible, it's usually because the host scans the key matrix too quickly for the UMR to react. There's a good chance that if one keyboard model has this problem, very similar models of the same vintage & manufacturer may also. But ultimately, trial-and-error is the only way to find out for sure.

[Vlad]

John and the Forum members,

Would it be possible to use UMR with a Martixed Switch for 65 notes using 8 X 9 = 72 scheme for the Italian Piano Accordion with 41 treble keys and 120 bass? The right treble side has 41 notes and would be in Channel 1, and the left button will use 24 bass notes (12 bass and 12 chords) would be in Channel 2. Incorporation of some kind of scheme to keep changing sound of instruments would be also a very nice feature. The UMR installed inside of a piano accordion would be connected via MIDI out to Korg NX5R sound module with over hundred of instrument's sounds.
I'm just searching for the best solution to replace my very old piano accordion with vintage MIDI controller with something that works good enough on newer PA.

[John]

John and the Forum members,

Would it be possible to use UMR with a Martixed Switch for 65 notes using 8 X 9 = 72 scheme for the Italian Piano Accordion with 41 treble keys and 120 bass? The right treble side has 41 notes and would be in Channel 1, and the left button will use 24 bass notes (12 bass and 12 chords) would be in Channel 2. Incorporation of some kind of scheme to keep changing sound of instruments would be also a very nice feature. The UMR installed inside of a piano accordion would be connected via MIDI out to Korg NX5R sound module with over hundred of instrument's sounds.
I'm just searching for the best solution to replace my very old piano accordion with vintage MIDI controller with something that works good enough on newer PA.

Hi Vlad, the UMR can only accept MIDI input in order to control a keyboard.

If you want to generate MIDI output, you'll need to use the MIDI CPU. I think it will work well for your project.

[Skatronix]

Hi, i got hold of this KORG PE-1000 string ensemble (polyfonic, analog) and im interested to midify it. Does UMR2 support this synth??

thanx for a great product (ive already done the CS01 midi retrofit), im looking forward to this new UMR2!!