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  #1  
Old 11-19-2012, 07:05 PM
boops boops is offline
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Default UMR2 and memorymoog

Hello all ,i plan to install UMR2 in my memorymoog ,is there someone who has already do that? i think it is possible....i am in electronic passionate not a pro..

here the keyboard schematic


http://s1235.photobucket.com/albums/...memorymoog.png

thanks for your help and best regards

Last edited by boops; 11-19-2012 at 07:09 PM.
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  #2  
Old 11-19-2012, 08:28 PM
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Hi boops, welcome. I will take a look at the image and see what I can determine from it.
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  #3  
Old 11-19-2012, 08:52 PM
boops boops is offline
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Default memormoog

Great ..thanks
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  #4  
Old 11-21-2012, 09:25 PM
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Boops,

Based on the schematic you have posted:



The Memorymoog looks like a good candidate for the UMR2. The matrix select polarity appears to be negative (-). So with the UMR2 in that configuration, you can connect the 8 select lines to the UMR2 select inputs, and the 8 data lines directly to the UMR2 data in/outs.

It looks like the select lines are at Q0..Q7 on the "LATCH" IC. Data lines are D4 and D5 of the top "BUFFER" IC and D0..D5 on the bottom "BUFFER" IC.
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Old 11-23-2012, 08:32 PM
boops boops is offline
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@ john ...thanks for this info

i have a few questions:

The MemoryMoog might play some tricks with the column
enables, setting them all low at the same time.... no problem with UMR2 ?

what happens if the same note is played by midi and keyboard ,no voltage problem ?

best regards
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  #6  
Old 11-28-2012, 07:58 PM
boops boops is offline
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UP no answers!

i ve just bought 2 UMR2 ...for two Memy..;-)

Last edited by boops; 11-28-2012 at 08:02 PM.
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  #7  
Old 11-29-2012, 03:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boops View Post
@ john ...thanks for this info

i have a few questions:

The MemoryMoog might play some tricks with the column
enables, setting them all low at the same time.... no problem with UMR2 ?
This is no problem.

Quote:
what happens if the same note is played by midi and keyboard ,no voltage problem ?
This is OK, too. When the UMR2 matrix polarity is set for "-", the data lines are always either a high-impedance (input) state or a logic-low (0V or ground potential) output. This is similar to an "open collector" type of circuit.
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Old 12-16-2012, 05:35 PM
boops boops is offline
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Thanks ..;UMR2 received....installation soon...
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  #9  
Old 05-23-2013, 05:06 PM
pato pato is offline
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Hi, I'm new in this forum, and I'm about to install a UMR-2 in a Memorymoog!

Before turning on the soldering iron, I have some questions:

Has the UMR-2/Memorymoog interfacing been tested in "real life" by somebody? Looking to the posts above, the "looks like" statement scares a little...

In the PDF manual, I've read the scarying sentence:

"CAUTION: Incorrect wiring of the UMR2 to the host switch matrix can permanently damage the UMR2 and host keyboard."

but I couldn't find any schematics or indications of the input/output electronic design of the UMR-2.... how can I insure it will definitively work?

For example, what's happens if a latch output of the Memory is unluckily at a low state on the same line as a high level UMR-2 output?

Thank you for any additional technical information - in order to know what I'm doing!

Best regards,

Patrick
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Old 05-23-2013, 09:50 PM
pato pato is offline
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Hi again,

Hopefully I could find some UMR technical information somewhere else in the forum, sounds good to me - feel confident now.

Could be a good point to put a link on this page on UMR home page.

I'll post the results of Memorymoog tests soon.

Patrick
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  #11  
Old 05-23-2013, 10:46 PM
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Hi Patrick, welcome to the forum.

I'm glad you found what you needed! Let us know how things go...
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  #12  
Old 05-29-2013, 07:04 PM
pato pato is offline
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Hi John,

Today I've tested the board with the Memory but unfortunately it was unsuccesful.

The board learned midi channel and lowest midi note correctly (red ACT led turned on), but when pressing the keys, the green led kept flashing.

Below the way I connected the board (refering to schematic above):

- Memory LATCH Q7 to UMR SELECT IN 1
- Memory LATCH Q6 to UMR SELECT IN 2
etc

- Memory BUFFER D0 to UMR DATA IN 1
- Memory BUFFER D1 to UMR DATA IN 2
etc

Is it valid?

I think just considering the diagram may not be enough to say it should work. It must be investigated further. Attached is the theory of operations of the keyboard matrix (from Memorymoog technical manual).

The point is that the latch put all the output low first to detect id any key is pressed. If at least one key is pressed, the CPU then decodes the key position. Is it compatible with the way the UMR's PIC works?
Attached Images
  
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  #13  
Old 05-30-2013, 01:42 PM
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Patrick,

In which position did you set the UMR2 matrix polarity jumper?
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Old 05-30-2013, 08:36 PM
pato pato is offline
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Hi John,

negative position, as explained above.

Please see photo attached.

Patrick
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Old 06-02-2013, 10:01 AM
pato pato is offline
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Any update?
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Old 06-04-2013, 01:55 PM
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Hi Patrick,

The polarity jumper looks good.

I just re-read your earlier post:

Quote:
Originally Posted by pato View Post
The board learned midi channel and lowest midi note correctly (red ACT led turned on), but when pressing the keys, the green led kept flashing.
This is not an error condition, per se. The green LED will flash continuously throughout the setup procedure.

However, when you press a key on the local keyboard, the red ACT LED should light for about 1 second for each keypress.

Does that make sense? After you set the lowest note with an external MIDI controller, what happens when you press a key on the Memory Moog?
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Old 06-04-2013, 08:17 PM
pato pato is offline
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Hi John,

We haven't seen any red led lighting even for 1 second when we pressed the local keyboard's keys, that's why we suspected that the local keyboard was not detected.

When pressing a key after pressing the lowest key of the external midi keyboard, the green led kept lighting, no red led.

When you look at the Memorymoog theory of operation as posted above, and considering how the PIC learn the matrix scanning scheme, should it work? That's the question.
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Old 06-05-2013, 12:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pato View Post
Hi John,

We haven't seen any red led lighting even for 1 second when we pressed the local keyboard's keys, that's why we suspected that the local keyboard was not detected.

When pressing a key after pressing the lowest key of the external midi keyboard, the green led kept lighting, no red led.

When you look at the Memorymoog theory of operation as posted above, and considering how the PIC learn the matrix scanning scheme, should it work? That's the question.
Yes. They Memorymoog appears to have a very typical keyboard matrix setup. The theory of operations is providing a detailed description of the implementation, but there is nothing unique about it from the perspective of the UMR2.

Do you have an oscilloscope? It might help to take a look at a pair of signals (one each select & data) and observe the waveforms when the corresponding key is pressed.
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Old 06-05-2013, 08:51 PM
pato pato is offline
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Yes, I can do that.

I'll keep you updated.
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  #20  
Old 08-02-2015, 01:42 PM
roginator roginator is offline
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any update on this ???
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